Weapons Training (for now, only non-firearms)*

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussions' started by RJ Clark, Jul 29, 2012.

  1. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    What weapons training and experiences (if any) have you* had or do outside your martial arts school and what effect does that have on your martial arts training? Also, have you been able to achieve a fusion or synergy between the dojo and your other training/experiences, or are they unaffected by one another?

    *WARNING: I've recently gained the ability to teleport anywhere in the world. So anyone who cites statistics or links me to a study as an answer, I will magically appear and choke you out at your computer.;)
     
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  2. Enkidu

    Enkidu Destroyer of your martial arts fantasies

    I learned various firearms, knife fighting and L.I.N.E. training while in the USMC. In college, I briefly fenced foil on a whim. The only bit of that weapons training that translated to martial arts training was fencing foil made my reaction speed better since I got better at reading subtle tells about when an attack was coming (because the foil moved too quickly to follow with your eyes so you have to react based on body clues).
     
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  3. MadoreGojuRyu

    MadoreGojuRyu Master

    I have studied one style, Goju Ryu, from one person for almost 18 years and stayed true to his teachings and went at the pace he set. I was never really happy with the pace he went with, in 18 years of training I earned my 5th degree black belt and was the most dominant fighter every week for almost 15 years, I was also his only full contact fighter and yet after all these years I never learned anything other than the Bo staff. I have very much adapted my life over the years to following Bushido and commited to staying loyal to my system.

    I finally branched out and started my own system and have since joined the IOGKF and learned a few weapons from a 7th degree black belt in Aikido, with the Jo becoming the weapon of choice for me. The Jo can go pretty much anywhere with me, I just have to fit one end with a rubber tip and the other end with a little leather strap and suddenly its a walking stick.

    Once I started training with these weapons it really did add a lot more to my way of thinking with training. I still dont understand why exactly he held back on his weapons training, especially since he is pretty darn close to retiring and probably doesnt have many years left to live anyways, not taking care of diabetes in the least isnt a smart thing.

    Any way, hopefully my long winded response was close to what you were asking for.
     
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  4. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I was always fascinated by this, particularly after reading that Bruce Lee had studied it. Seems about every college has some form of fencing offered, so maybe I'll sign up for fun and to learn something entirely new.
     
  5. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I'm interested in everyone's story, no matter how brief or long. Thanks for the info!
     
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  6. David Manson

    David Manson Disciple

    I like to teach improvised, common everyday objects. Like keys between the fingers, swinging a heavy belt buckel, learning to kick with cowboy boots (yes I know they are out of style). Learning to use whatever is at hand because you can't walk around the mall with a katana stuck in your belt. Think about it, anything can use as a weopen or a distraction.
     
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  7. MadoreGojuRyu

    MadoreGojuRyu Master

    lol, this is the reason i try to make my jo staff look like a walking staff, I try to keep the weapons a little more practical while trying to keep the weapons in the system that are traditional. so I am with you on this one 100%, havent thought much of keys but have taught a few moms about using their purses in an offensive and defensive manner, even had one 'trophy wife' that wears heels just about every where that i tried to teach to use her heels....dont know if anything i told her actually stuck with her, i think she just wanted to be seen more than learn anything of value.
     
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  8. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    As part of Women's Self Defense I cover various weapons/improvised weapons and make recommendations. One is the Asp Palm Defender mace and the other is the "cute" mini brass knuckle items like the cat face keychain here:http://www.trueswords.com/keychain-defense-black-p-5294.html
     
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  9. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I am shodan in Ju Jutsu, yet many of the traditional weapons were covered almost as an afterthought, such as the bo, jo, jutte, tanto, etc. I relished that training as it fused well with my FMA training. IMO there should have been more time dedicated to that, especially the shorter weapons that would reasonably simulate the type of weapons you'd face today.
     
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  10. Muay Thai Samurai

    Muay Thai Samurai Never Back Down

    I have always had a fascination with the sword and own a katana which i train with from time to time i also use a wooden type training sword or Bokken for obvious safety reasons and i also own several types of combat knifes from different parts of the world which i practice with often, funny thing is i always liked using a front grip with knifes but my buddy who was in the army told me that a backhand technique was better i had to respectfully disagree while both have there advantages i feel like a backhand slash can be more easily seen by a defender and thus easier to counter or avoid were as a frontal grip while not as powerful would be quicker and more accurate
     
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  11. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I prefer the front type grip as well - for me it facilitates flow and certain targets are easier to hit with that grip, such as the axillary/brachial vein and femoral artery. Plus the extra reach/range to go for a quick slice on the hand or wrist to disarm.
     
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  12. Aaron Hutto

    Aaron Hutto Master

    My only real weapons training has been FMA stick and knife. I have done a bit of other training but nothing serious. My weapon of choice is a rattan stick - plain and simple. I am also a fan of the bali, karambit, and kukri though.
     
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  13. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I have (and love) six 28" ash octagonal sticks and two 20" shorties made from my old pole clip, er, poles (sorry for the "Allow myself to introduce myself" moment, haha!). Not too much heavier than my rattans, but boy do they hit hard. I've also made "pretty" sticks out of striped maple saplings and such when I'd have to cut them on the job. Used to love karambits, but they do get stuck in what you want to cut. Never really used kukri, but they are beautiful.
     
  14. Nexquietus

    Nexquietus Disciple

    I was also one of those guys who trained in an art up to black belt that never really learned weapons. THEN I got into Pekiti Tersia Kali. Oh Boy! To go from a "Worst case scenario, the guy pulls a Knife" mentality, into a "Even if you don't see one, assume he has a knife" one is / was hard. Everything we train is with weapons, and to train empty hand, we use weapons to emphasize angles and concepts. My brother and I have basically the same background and we (if I do say so my self) have managed to hybridize what we have learned very well. Judo and Aikijujutsu shouldn't mesh well with Kali, but we make it. We were pretty active competitively in Judo a while back, so when it comes to round fighting, we can handle ourselves pretty good, coupled with the weapons, well, it makes a pretty good time.

    I have had a paradigm shift since I have been learning. I am trying to bring my knife carrying into line with my training. I like reverse grip, especially when you think in terms like I do. Held in front of you blade edge in (toward the forearm). Any passes benefit from the extra power you generate with your lats as you pull back. Thrust wise, you should be aiming for the dangerous part anyways: THE HAND THAT HOLDS THE WEAPON. De-fang the snake and you have a worm. (Ooo I like that so much I have found a Sig line). Slashes are still available of course, just trickier. One other thing, a hidden weapon deployed fast always seems faster than a brandished weapon held out for all to see. Think how that knife looks when held at your side, thumb cupped over the end like you are supposed to, knife hidden from sight by your arm. For all intents you look to have a clenched fist. But you don't.

    Just my observations and experiences.

    jim
     
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  15. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    I think Judo meshes very well with FMA (for me Vee Arnis Jitsu) and I'm always looking to catch/grip, unbalance and/or throw in relation to their weapon while flowing with a blade or stick. It's cool that we have parallels in our training but we have different methodologies/preferences. You like the reverse grip for the power stroke and stealth whereas I like the hammer or saber grips for the better flow and reach (for me anyway). I also like to use the handle and/or extended pommel for strikes, and some leverage techniques after they're disarmed.
    I think that the hand/wrist cut or strike isn't emphasized enough in weapon vs weapon (or under appreciated). It's another reason why I like the hammer & saber grips as I can slip that cut in faster and more accurately, I mentioned that in a post above (again, just my preference)
    I do like that Defang the snake... grandfather clause me in on using that if you copyright it, please;)
     
  16. Caneman

    Caneman Test all things.

    Outside of the Do Jang... I have really only become proficient in one "held" weapon... that is the cane.
    INNOCUOUS... it is.
    It melds very well into my base non-weapon training in TSD. I think longer style, longer weapon...
    I have heard some describe the cane as: sword, short staff, whip... I agree with that but will add one or two to that list...
    Trap and hook spear... these are both crook functions... with the crook used for trapping/locking, with ease of throwing by shaft leverage (in comes more of my HapKiDo and Yudo background then)... and the end of the crook for perferation (typically into to the ribs, spine or neck). Frankly, I seldom use the "hook spear" until finishing the final opponent, unless position is perfect of the remaining opponents.
    I have recently started a little bit of Dan Bong (12 inch) stick training, and it allows for fairly complete transition to weaponless hand, or knife... along with any other short object you may hold (pen, scissors, TV remote, telephone hand set, wooden kitchen spoon, etc.). This has been very good for hand speed work, but I have found I have needed to throw out about 50% of the series I have been working with, as I don't like about that much when you use the techniques against a trained fighter.
    I have much more of an affinity for carrying that 39.5 inch long 1 inch thick piece of hickory (cane). I can draw about a 6-7 foot radius around me as a "kill" zone... easily with two unarmed (or short weaponed) well trained attackers, and about 75% with 3 and 4 opponents.
    Funniest thing to me, when I travel... passing through security, TSA agents ask "Sir, do you need your cane to walk through?" I just smile and say "No thank you, I am fine."
    BUT, they would confiscate that 12" stick in an instant.
     
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  17. Nexquietus

    Nexquietus Disciple

    I wonder how the TSA would look at one of the Cold Steel City Sticks?
     
  18. RJ Clark

    RJ Clark Tree Ninja Staff Member

    Ah, the cane. Please don't be offended, but when I think of it as a weapon I always envision a white-haired, wizened old man with a fu manchu mustache defeating a group of thugs utilizing perfect timing, minimal effort, and precise weapon movements and transitions...:)
    Certainly an unsung but potentially devastating weapon. I don't think many people realize the curvature of the crook essentially transfers the fulcrum point to the pinky which in turn increases speed and impact (when the cane is held with the crook as the "pommel", so to speak). Worth noting that many traditional Filipino blades have this curvature in the handle and/or on the pommel.
     
  19. Caneman

    Caneman Test all things.

    None taken!
    I have struggled with it myself, that way. It is really a weapon "out of time". 150 years ago, gentlemen used to take them everywhere. Of course the sword cane was popular then too.
    I don't wear a top hat or bowler though... LMAO
     
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  20. Aaron Hutto

    Aaron Hutto Master

    I have a very traditional kukri hand made in India. I love it! It is not the fastest weapon (certainly not like my karambit or bali) but it does the job very well. 12" bade which is just over 1/4" thick. It is a very beefy medium range weapon that would have no problem taking someone's arm off if it were over extended.
     
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